Today’s Youth Discuss Sustainability-Related Issues

Youth Speaker:

We kind of need to think about like the underlying determinants, that impact people's ability to be sustainable and also like corporation's ability to be sustainable. So when we talk about a just transition and we want to have all these like great impacts and we want to reduce our negative environmental impacts. Well, we also need to think about people's lives and various factors in their lives that contribute to their ability to be more sustainable, but also their inability to do the same.

Michael Torrance:

Welcome to Sustainability Leaders. I'm Michael Torrance, chief sustainability officer with BMO Financial Group. On this show, we will talk with leading sustainability practitioners from the corporate investor, academic and NGO communities to explore how this rapidly evolving field of sustainability is impacting global investment business practices and our world.

Speaker 1: 

The views expressed here are those of the participants and not those of Bank of Montreal, it's affiliates or subsidiaries.

Michael Torrance:

Today, we have a special episode from a recent event BMO hosted to provide youth from planned Canada's Girls Belong Here program, an opportunity to consult and share their unique on sustainability related issues with BMO sustainability team. The event was hosted and facilitated by BMO's diversity, equity, and inclusion team. It was split into three discussions, including a deep dive into sustainability and just transition topics. Let's now listen to what the youth had to say.

Alice Bow:

My name is Alice Bow. I'm part of the BMO's sustainability team. Very excited to meet all of you and hear more.

Whitney McQuaid:

My name is Whitney McQuaid. I'm part of the sustainability team here at BMO. My pronouns are she and her. And for today, I'm just very excited to meet all of you and take this opportunity to kind of step back from our busy day to day and hear some new perspectives and learn from you all and take all of that back as inspiration for our day to day work. So thank you for joining us.

Alice Bow:

So Whitney and I will facilitate the first session on an introduction to sustainability. So the first question is what does sustainability mean to you?

Youth Speaker:

So when I think of sustainability, I think of equity and equality. I don't think you can have true sustainable change without considering everyone and everyone's needs.

Youth Speaker:

For me, I find that sustainability is almost like a way of living where everybody is doing their own part to make sure that all people, every everywhere have the ability to be able to sustain life now and in the future,

Youth Speaker:

To me, it's large stakeholders doing their part to conserve scarce resources. The scarcity of, of our natural, our lands.

Youth Speaker:

Sustainability to me means renewability and something that's diverse and inclusive and takes multiple perspectives into account.

Youth Speaker:

I think like investment in forward thinking technologies. So sort of like the reallocation of funds towards technologies that help to serve sustainable purposes.

Whitney:

It's an interesting point about divesting and it's something that we discuss a lot here at the bank because we do lend to fossil fuel companies. And we think that as a bank we're really, our role is really to be partners to our clients. And so fossil fuel companies for sure have a huge impact on climate change and sustainability. And they're getting pressure from their stakeholders to transition to a net zero world as well. And so at the bank, we have an opportunity to share the knowledge that we're developing for our own system sustainability program, with those clients to help them transition. And if we stop lending to them, then that relationship is broken and we can no longer behave in that partnership way. So it's an interesting kind of debate that's ongoing, but it's a really good point. You raise.

Youth Speaker:

I think that it's also about everybody being self-aware of all the actions that they are taking so that they know that every time that they make a specific action, they know what the impacts are and what the repercussions are for the future.

Youth Speaker:

I think partnership in governance and partnership and policy is such a key component to this because they're the ones who are able to put pressure on industry to ensure that this change actually goes through, that there aren't constraints between business relationships. So I think that's really important.

Whitney:

Really good points is I especially like the point about partnership, because these are such big challenges that we're trying to solve. And so I think Raya made the point, we can all use the steel straws, but on our own, that's not going to make a meaningful difference. And so we all need to work together and have, I think a common goal post that we're trying to achieve in order to really be successful. So we've talked a lot about kind of big picture, what does sustainability mean to you? Maybe we can move on to the second question, which is more I think like tangibly, what do you want the future to look like? What would a sustainable future look like to you guys?

Whitney:

Sure. So I would say more opportunities, where people are able to share their opinions like this one, but in like a variety of different countries where people are able to connect and share ideas. I think if just, if each country just works by themselves, they're not going to be able to do anything.

Youth Speaker:

It's like important to let everyone to have the equal access to same resources, like such as like access to clean water, to sanitization, to healthcares and to education, especially girls education, like everyone, like those resources to be distributed equally to people around the world. Like not just in North America, not just in Canada, but also in Africa, in South America, those developing countries.

Youth Speaker:

And to add on to what Judy just said. I think that, especially here, we don't realize all the opportunities that we have and just what some of the issues, what other issues there are around the world. So it starts here.

Whitney:

Do you mean Cassie that like being located like in a country like Canada that's developed and we have a lot of opportunities and so we should be kind of leading by example for countries who are starting maybe from a different starting point.

Youth Speaker:

Yeah, Absolutely.

Youth Speaker:

Yeah. I would say what a world that's more like equally represented. So governments that have more female leaders in them, and that might lead to safer environments for women and those who feel discriminated against.

Youth Speaker:

For organizational structures, governments, NGOs, to have an iterative process to measure their sustainability. I think that, like we have an idealized version of what we want a sustainable future to look like, but in reality there's always challenges. So yeah, sort of in sort of starting to make that framework, to be able to address those problems by constantly looking back at the track record and seeing where we can improve. I think that begins to solve the problem in a sustainable way.

Whitney:

A sustainability target is always going to be a moving target because there'll always be more that we can do or new problem that emerge that we need to tackle. And so, as you say, readjusting targets and understanding, understanding what the future should look like and keeping on moving in that direction is super important.

Youth Speaker:

Just to add on to like the renewable energies, making them more cost efficient, because I know for a lot of developing countries, for example, it's really expensive, especially because they don't have the infrastructure for non-renewable energy, which is usually cheaper in a variety of places.

Whitney:

Also a great point. Maybe we can move on to the next question, which kind of moves into some solutioning a little bit. So we've talked a lot about partnerships and what the world could look like. What role do you guys think a corporation has in achieving the things that you've spoken about?

Youth Speaker:

If there are large corporations or companies, I think that it's their role as almost like a figure and society to lead by example, and to create and to do and produce their products and to produce their services in a renewable way and in a way that is sustainable.

Youth Speaker:

And I think in being integrated, there's this responsibility of educating others and calling them in. And I think, for example, when I go to my bank, there's a lot of like education about how to even like save up now, so that your future, I feel like if you can educate people about savings, you can also educate people about how to be more sustainable.

Whitney:

Yeah. Excellent point. Right. It's one of the things that really appealed to me before I joined BMO. I've had been with BMO for two years now and the idea of working in sustainability for a bank was super exciting because as you say, banks are so pervasive and really underpin the whole economy. So we have a real opportunity to use that position in society to have positive impact.

Youth Speaker:

Yeah. I think all of these are wonderful ideas and to add on, I think also investing in small businesses and sustainable businesses is really, really important.

Youth Speaker:

I just want to jump in on that point. Exactly. This is a personal story, but my father, when he came to this country from Sri Lanka as an immigrant, the only bank that would lend to him was BMO. So I just want to say like in investing in diverse people is very critical because you never know when they can invest back in the company and in the organizational structure. So investing in small business is definitely a part of that. But yeah, I just wanted to add that.

Whitney:

Thanks for sharing. That's a great story.

Alice Bow:

I think another point is a responsibility to also embed sustainability internally. So engaging with other teams who don't focus on sustainability on a day to day, really educating them. And then they can also bring the learnings and be creating new ideas within their goals, their mandates, and bringing it also back home.

Whitney:

Maybe I'll flip the question upside down and say, do you think there's a limit to what corporations should be expected to do to ensure a sustainable future?

Youth Speaker:

I actually wanted to ask this question in terms of like, how much is BMO able to maybe put pressure on like government to change policies? I guess almost what it, I'm asking the question too, what do you think is the role of BMO in terms of influencing policies and to create sustainable change?

Whitney:

I think there's a role we can play. So we announced our net zero ambition earlier this year. And so we've been doing a lot of work this year to think through what that means and The BMO Climate Institute who you'll hear from some of the folks who are part of that Institute later has been set up to help us play that role, to bring together our clients, government, academia, to advance knowledge on climate change. So what are the risks and opportunities associated with climate change and how can we as a bank use our financial power to help our clients advance their sustainable practices? So there definitely is a role to play.

Youth Speaker: 

Everyone has like different levels of financial ability or even in their lives, like how much they're able, how much time they're able to spend on being more sustainable. And we need to consider those factors as well in terms of the independent experience.

Youth Speaker: 

Raya, I think that's a perfect segue to our final question, which is about the competing demands to achieving sustainability. So you mentioned time, finances, anything else anyone can think of that would compete against the ultimate goal of improving sustainability?

Youth Speaker: 

I think as well, like cultural backgrounds in the way that people were raised and just kind of, some people will have that background in no. Oh, I've always done it this way, even though it might not necessarily be the most sustainable way of getting something done.

Youth Speaker:

Yeah, I think it can be really overwhelming to have to make this change. Because then when you think about it, everything in your life, some part of it is going to be unsustainable. Like even if you buy something sustainable, it's highly low likely that it was transported in a way that wasn't sustainable. So you just feel super overwhelmed about all of the impact that you're making.

Whitney:

Awesome. Thank you. I think it goes back to the first question, which is what does sustainability mean to you? And to me it means kind of the sweet spot between doing what's right for the environment, doing what's right for other people and still doing what's right to you. So to your point, not everybody can do everything, but we can all do something. And so finding out the things that you can do either as a person or as a company or as a government or whatever, that makes sense for you and then have an impact is how we can make progress. So thanks everyone for all of your responses and inputs. I think we've raised a lot of really good themes across environment, social and economic, which are kind of the three main pillars of sustainability. And I think we'll be able to explore those a little bit more in the next session on just transition, which really explores kind of the overlap between in particular climate and social objectives.

Sheila Brison-Bennett:

Hi, great to meet everyone. My name's Sheila Brison-Bennett. I'm a legal council and I'm part of sustainability team. My preferred pronouns are she/ her/hers. I'm really excited for this afternoon and looking forward to our discussion on the just transition. I firmly believe that youth have the most at stake in terms of the future for obvious reasons. And so hearing your perspectives today is so important, especially when we talk about a just transition and what it means to be the generation that's going to be going to be making decisions in 2015. Yeah. So please just feel free to just share your perspectives because they're so important.

Marcella Aray:

Hello everyone. My name is Marcella, my last name is Aray. My pronouns are she and hers. So excited to be here, super excited to see that there are some engineers in the room as well as people from other countries that is super exciting. I'm originally from Columbia, I'm an engineer as well. I did my university in Columbia move for my master's student Netherlands. And here I am in Canada, super excited as well to be part of this conversation today, just transition is definitely something that we have been talking about a lot recently in the particular in related to climate change.

Sheila Brison-Bennett:

So thanks for the discussion that we just came from. I think hearing what you all had to say, there's a lot of, there's a lot of comments, a lot of ideas coming forward that really speak to the topic of a just transition. So what we wanted to explore with you today are a few questions around the just transition. It's a topic that's of personal interest to Marcella and myself and also others on our team. It's also something that's important to institutions like ours as we move forward through this. And as we talk about transitioning to low carbon economy, for us, when we think about this and, and from me personally as well, we know that there's often historically been disproportionate impacts on communities. How do you learn from the past in order to build a better future for all?

Sheila Brison-Bennett:

And we really think that it's important to hear the voices of girls, women in building that future. And we know we have this problem of climate change. We know there's a just transition coming. We hear more and more about a just transition, but we need to move into conversations around solutions and even more so, I was just noting in preparing for this, that there was another research piece out that was saying that babies born in 2020, we'll have twice as many droughts and three times as many floods in their lifetimes. And I think two times as many heat waves, but that if we can hold to the 1.5, we reduce that dramatically. So what does a just transition mean to you?

Youth Speaker: 

Just transition is basically moving towards a more sustainable and inclusive model of development.

Youth Speaker: 

I think that like when I think of what does, like a just transition mean, I think of a transition into a more sustainable future, but where nobody gets left behind, because just because something might be like out of sight and forgotten about that, doesn't be in that the problem doesn't exist there because it still will be there. So making sure that everybody is always included and to take extra precautions, to make sure that those specific groups that we know have historically been forgotten about are included.

Youth Speaker: 

We kind of need to think about like the underlying determinants that impact people's ability to be sustainable and also like corporation's ability to be sustainable. So when we talk about a just transition and we want to have all these like great impacts and want to reduce our negative environmental impact. Well, we also need to think about people's lives and various factors in their lives that contribute to their ability to be more sustainable, but also their inability to do the same.

Marcella Aray:

I have a question for all of you, what is transitioning? Like what exactly in our economy, in the way how life goes, what is it exactly that is changing? When we talk about just transition or transition in general, what are those things that are underpinning that made your transition? Like what is it that is changing and why it's changing?

Youth Speaker: 

So what I really like about the term transition and what it implies is that I feel like it's addressing these systemic issues and it's addressing the system more. So it's not just trying to deal with, okay, well, we have a lot of pollution, which you know, is an issue, but it's also trying to go, okay, why do we have so much pollution? What's going on there? How do we make that better? How do we change the system to be more equitable? And something that came up in one of the pre-reads and I have over here, but it's moving towards environmental and sustainable economy where everyone has decent work, social inclusion and eradication of poverty.

Marcella Aray:

Yeah, that's great. Sheila, would you say before we continue with the discussion, would you say that when in general, when the media, government, when those sort of voices talked about the just transition, do you think they're talking about first and foremost about this revolution that has to happen around the way how we produce and use energy?

Sheila Brison-Bennett:

Yeah. And I think that is, that's exactly where it's starting is, I think is this conversations around the transitioning to a low carbon economy and sort of this idea of the transformation of our societies away from what we've kind of known in terms of how we use and consume energy and how it is used across all the economic sectors and really talking about there's going to be changes to how we do work. There's going to be changes to how we move about, there's going to be changes to how we consume and what we ask for as consumers, what are the substitutes we're looking for? And, and I think the way the conversation is often framed is often not necessarily looking at what are the impact, the social impacts of this transition to a low carbon economy. And so, how do you create, fair jobs, there's a role for everyone to play. And I think we're all just trying to figure out what that role is.

Marcella Aray:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). So maybe we can think a little bit about what is the problem? Like how is the way how we produce and consume energy now is not just? Why we need to move to a more just system and why it's not just? Any thoughts on why, the way, how we, our energy system works works is not just.

Youth Speaker: 

It's not just because it does cause a lot of pollution and it affects the communities that live areas where oil like mining and oil industries. But I think that transitioning those who have jobs in the non-renewable industry into a renewable industry is really, really important. Because a lot of communities do rely on that as sources of income.

Marcella Aray:

Yeah. Yeah. Those are great points, really like the way how you connect it health. Right? So the pollution is not just because it's affects who it affect a lot of kids, right? They are growing, they are developing. It's not just because they are sort of, as Sheila was mentioning at the beginning, one of the main sort of communities in groups that are affected by that, right. You also mention about it's going to be transitioning into new jobs, right? So there will be an opportunity you to participate in, the explosion that we're going to see with renewables with electric cars, electric transportation in general. So there will be a lot, a lot of new jobs and that concept of just justice in that transition is how do we make sure that those [inaudible 00:22:47] communities where it is women for instance, I want to hear a little bit on your perspectives on that. How do we make sure that women have access to all of those new jobs?

Youth Speaker: 

I think it's the way it is right now and things that are holding folks back from a just transition and something that makes a just transition so important is because the way society's structured right now, it favors certain groups. And so in order for us to really dig deeper into kind of going through all the effects that and the causes of issues, it's important to work toward more equitable policies and that too will help us ensure that no one is left behind as we work towards a just transition.

Marcella Aray:

Mm-hmm (affirmative). So definitely the role of the governments, right? Making sure that those policies exist and protect those communities that might not necessarily have a loud voice, so that is really key.

Youth Speaker: 

We need to move away from these unequal power dynamics and exploitation. It's called like just transition for a reason because it's a transition. It's not like a jump, it's a full process. So it's making sure that like making sure that everyone's on board and everybody understands how to make that transition and how to work together towards that more sustainable future.

Marcella Aray:

Sheila, do you want to close and close maybe with some [insightful? 00:24:12] thoughts?

Sheila Brison-Bennett:

Yeah. Happy to this has all been really insightful and really helpful to hear all the different perspectives Marcella and I were, as we were preparing for this, we came across what we think is a great quote by, is it Mary Robinson, Marcella?

Marcella Aray:

Climate change is a man made problem with a feminist solution.

Sheila Brison-Bennett:

We thought that was good. Really just wanted to thank all of you and thanks for this invigorating discussion.

Susan:

Hi everybody. I'm Susan. I am excited to be representing BMO as well along with my colleagues at this session. I'm the head of the BMO Climate Institute. My preferred pronouns are she and her. I also teach a course for those of you at U of T. I teach a graduate course at the University of Toronto in climate finance, and it's a teaching role. But the thing that keeps me there for over a decade was all of the learning that I take away from the students as we discuss, ways to advance climate action, as well, new business models. And I'm super excited to hear from you and for any of all of you at U of T, I hope you one day in your graduate work, if you go there, take this course as well.

Kona:

[foreign language] My name is Kona Gule, she/her, I am the head of indigenous equity and inclusion. I'm Cree [inaudible]. I'm originally from La Ronge in Northern Saskatchewan, in Canada, and I'm very passionate about the role of indigenous people when it comes to thinking about sustainability and a sustainable future, and really excited to learn and hear about the perspectives that you will each bring to the topic. So really a privilege to be here today. [foreign language] So I think actually this, this discussion really builds on the conversation that we were just having. And I think maybe, and I'm hoping in this final discussion for the day that we can go a little bit deeper into some of the topics and some of the issues that you were all raising.

Kona:

When we think about a just transition, and many of you have raised the issues of equity and equality, it's stepping back and reflecting like right now we have about 6 million jobs in coal power, electricity, petroleum extraction, and others that are going to be gone by 2030. But there is an estimated, nearly 30 million new jobs by 2050 in renewable energy right now in oil and gas, women comprise about 22% of the workforce, but we actually see promising signs within renewable energy where women represent one and three. But again, it's we're still talking about one in three and not full gender representation. We also see under-representation of women in stem, in other areas that could help contribute to progressing a just transition. So what is the role to you of women when you think about a just transition?

Youth Speaker: 

I think that women have an important role because in the past they've been left out of the energy industry and a variety of other industries that have been leading change. But if we want a just transition, we need those opinions and those values that are more diverse, especially for women of color that have been left out of the conversation.

Youth Speaker: 

Yeah. I think it's important for women in positions of power and their roles in the just transition to keep in mind intersectionality, that the struggles of some women are different from the struggles of others and other gender minority people. And it's important to make space for those who do not already have it.

Susan:

So when we're talking about the value of women in the just transition, which is fantastic, and you've covered so many ways that the diversity of perspectives can accelerate change, I wanted to pick up on the women being role models. What do you think the opportunity is for women to actually take a more active role as opposed to kind of waiting for it?

Youth Speaker: 

I think in a just transition, there should be a lot of mentorship opportunities that arise, but mentorship really allows for that kind of extending your hand down, pulling other women up.

Youth Speaker: 

You know, advocacy itself is hard work and doing that sort of labor to make space for others when you yourself are an oppressed person is hard. So I think it is valuable for women to try and build into these systems, the capacity to have more diverse voices at the table to make sure that the change that they're making is impactful. That it's systemic and structural.

Susan:

Yes. Excellent. And I think what many of you are saying too, is that leaning in, it is the institution's role, but I like Judy your point too, that sometimes women are involved in the creative destruction and this is a creative destruction. So there are going to be new business models. There are going to be new financing models. There are going to be lots of new ways, innovative ways to transition to a low carbon economy. It's going be an overhaul of our existing economy. And so the opportunity is there for new voices to engage in that creative destruction and build out. And so for women and men, but certainly for women to develop business models and design these as the new business models are find you have an opportunity to make them more friendly to women.

Youth Speaker: 

Yeah. Just going back to what Kona was saying about how we're going to have an incredible increase in jobs because of the introduction of renewable energy. And I think in there are lies many opportunities for women to simply be employed more. We have this incredible opportunity to not have any more tokenization and have like real value and actually really see the value in women and equal representation.

Kona:

I think that's a terrific segue to talking about what barriers women and marginalized groups might face in that equal participation and a just transition.

Youth Speaker: 

There's this huge push for women to go into some specific fields that maybe there isn't as much representation in such as stem, for example. But once within that field, it's still not necessarily easy or not necessarily given the same opportunities.

Youth Speaker: 

Regarding women in stem too. I mean, this is applicable there. There's a lot of graduates who come out with stem degrees or business degrees and finance degrees excited and interested in entering the field. But I think where there is often challenges as maybe mid-career women, maybe there's fatigue working in at the executive level. So I'm wondering like why is it that women start to drop off in these executive roles as time goes by throughout their career and addressing those challenges for mid-career women.

Kona:

Those are really important questions.

Youth Speaker: 

In the lab, for example, women can be admitted into labs and given these opportunities, but they'll often miss out on socializing opportunities for their coworkers because they're traditionally male activities. There are these stereotypes that are hindering equal value and really incredible conversations because women are just not valued. Even if they're given a seat at the table.

Youth Speaker: 

I think a lot of women also feel really scared about the opportunities that they're exposed to because they might feel discouraged because they don't feel like they're good enough to even apply to certain jobs. And so I think it's really important to boost their confidence and make them feel like they are welcome.

Kona:

Yeah. That's been a repeated theme in the comments that you have all conveyed here is the need to actually to respond to the needs of women in marginalized groups, not just create equal access, but to actually meet people where they're at to give them the opportunity. This might be a good opportunity to think about this from the perspective of youth. And maybe Susan I'll hand it over to you to pose this question to the group.

Susan:

Yeah. This is something that the global risk survey, which comes out every year, they identify it's a forum of leaders, but also youth leaders. And so they identify the top risks facing us over the year. And one of them was the youth disillusionment and how hard it would be to transition to a low carbon economy if youth disillusionment becomes pervasive across our economies.

Susan:

And so I asked the class, the students that I teach, if, if this is a reality to them and the responses were mixed. There are, probably half, felt very optimistic about their ability to effect change. And the other half did feel that disillusionment was setting in and I'm curious to know, and they shared some reasons. I'm curious to hear yours, in terms of, whether you are optimistic or whether you're feeling some disillusionment. Why and what do you think we could be doing about it in our own places of work to prevent this? Some of the students said they're going to be affected by it. They understand it, they study it and yet they don't have the positions yet to make change. And so they're influenced by business leaders who are deciding their future.

Youth Speaker: 

Youth disillusionment is part of my reality. And it's part of the reality of many of my peers and maybe for different reasons that I feel this way. But I think that when, as you get older and you enter the marketplace and you start working for a living, paying rent and you don't see that your reality is changing in the way that you are so optimistic that it would, when you were younger.

Susan:

Important to address then, absolutely.

Youth Speaker: 

Advocacy burnout is definitely something that I've experienced personally. And I think part of that just lies in the fact that yes, we are super educated, but we almost know too much. Like we know too much about how terrible the world is and we don't have enough power or resources to do anything about it. And that can be extremely overwhelming and disheartening.

Youth Speaker: 

Another factor behind youth disillusionment also goes with us, trying to kind of stop these patterns or try to not indulge or like give to immoral and like unethical corporations, however we have such limited ability to do so. It makes it really difficult. So that's one area where it does definitely come into play, but in other areas, such as a program like Girls Belong Here, that does make things easier.

Kona:

Kind of echoing some of the comments. I really appreciated the kind of integrated thinking around a just transition and what sustainability means to each of you.

Youth Speaker: 

It was really fascinating to be part of this discussion. I think, this is a rare opportunity for people who are not in this industry to be able to hear the progress and the steps. And yeah, it's encouraging, enthusing to see all these women in positions of authority and power being part of these conversations to sort of facilitate this knowledge transition to other young leaders. So I just want to commend BMO for continually stepping up in this role. It was very interesting to see and of course, it's always pleasure to be among peers. So I also congratulate all my peers on this, it was a very, very fruitful discussion and awesome to hear.

Michael Torrance:

Thanks for listening to Sustainability Leaders. This podcast is presented by BMO Financial Group to access all the resources we discussed in today's episode, and to see our other podcasts, visit us at bmo.com/sustainabilityleaders. You can listen and subscribe free to our show on Apple Podcasts or your favorite podcast provider, and we'll greatly appreciate a rating and review and any feedback that you might have. Our show and resources are produced with support from BMO's marketing team and Puddle Creative. Until next time I'm Michael Torrance have a great week.

Speaker 1:

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